[Air-L] Difficult Discussion: What's Missing -- Digest, Vol 234, Issue 29

[Sky Croeser]

I believe that my initial email provided my justification (and careful
citations for each claim I made) for why we should speak up on this when we
have not issued statements on other acts of violence.

This includes the scale of the killing in Gaza, the attacks on civilians,
the attacks on universities, and the ongoing and worsening situation in
Gaza.

I did mention the Hamas attacks, noting that my government has taken a
strong stance and offered assistance to Israel. My initial email said that
where our governments are silent, we should speak up.

As I have reiterated, I don't think we need to replay the entire history of
the region in order to call for an end to attacks on civilians, attacks on
universities, and attacks on civilian infrastructure.

I would like to point out the danger of arguing that massive civilian
casualties and collective punishment (particularly withholding fuel, food,
and water) are justified if military objectives would otherwise be
difficult to achieve. If that is a general principle one supports (rather
than a rule for only one side of a conflict) it can justify many horrors.

I hope that I have misunderstood what seems to be a claim by several
academics on this list that it is reasonable to attack civilians (including
children and infants) if they are near, mixed with, or even possibly may
have voted for or somehow approve of groups considered to be military
targets.

On Tue, 23 Jan 2024 at 3:16 am, חן סבג בן-פורת via Air-L <
air-l at listserv.aoir.org> wrote:

> Sam,
> Thank you for these words of truth. I eagerly await the reference of the
> members who have responded to the issues you have raised.
> Chen
> *_________**_________**_________**_________**_________**_________*
> *_________**_________**_________*
> *Dr. Chen Sabag Ben-Porat *
> The Moskowitz School of Communication
> Ariel University
>
>
>
>
> ‫בתאריך יום ב׳, 22 בינו׳ 2024 ב-15:49 מאת ‪Sam Lehman-wilzig via Air-L‬‏ <‪
> air-l at listserv.aoir.org‬‏>:‬
>
> > The call for some sort of “response” to Israel’s actions might have some
> > legitimacy if:
> >
> >   1.  Previously we heard similar calls against China’s cultural genocide
> > against the Uighurs.
> >   2.  Ditto: any call to stop the slaughter of HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of
> > Africans in the Sudan.
> >   3.  Some mention of Hamas’s Oct. 7 atrocities, VIDEO-documented by
> THEIR
> > OWN FIGHTERS.
> >   4.  Some mention of the fact that in contravention of all international
> > law, Hamas abducted and is holding hostage for over 3 months Israeli
> > civilian women, men, and children.
> >   5.  Hamas hid massive amounts of armaments in hospitals, schools,
> > kindergartens, and private civilian homes (e.g., under baby cribs!!) –
> > again, against Geneva Convention laws of warfare. Thus, where exactly is
> > Israel supposed to fight? Just on roads or parks?
> >   6.  Israel sent messages (flyers and phone calls!) to all Gazan
> > civilians in North Gaza to get out and move south in order NOT to be in
> the
> > line of fire when the IDF attacked Hamas soldiers. This is the very
> > opposite of intended genocide.
> >   7.  If already people here mention “genocide”, then what do you call
> > Hamas’ Charter that calls for the elimination not of Israelis but of all
> > JEWS? And after Oct. 7, their spokesman said that they will do it (Oct.
> 7)
> > again and again. So who exactly is “genocidal” here?
> > Given that this forum is for academics, one would expect a bit more
> > “context” in respondents’ posts – not to mention understanding and noting
> > ALL the facts involved.
> >
> > Prof. Sam Lehman-Wilzig
> > 3 Yitzchak Sadeh St.
> > 4423918 Kfar Saba
> > ISRAEL
> > 052-3410163
> > www.ProfSLW.com<http://www.profslw.com/>
> >
> >
> >